2011 Escalade ESV Engine Replacement

[swathdiver]

Well I've been a member for a while but haven't posted...

We have a 2011 ESV, no major issues until last week we started her up and she sounded like a locomotive. Turns out the lifters are bad and it has pitting in the camshaft. Translation, rebuild the top end or buy a new engine.

She has 141k miles (60k from us), leaning towards about $8,100 to swap it out with a new motor with a 3 yr 100k mile warranty vs the $6-7k rebuild option.

Curious if anyone else has done this or if I'm crazy for doing it, it's paid off and has new shocks, tires and control arm bushings and a recent trans service so it seems like it's worth it, vs the $800-ish monthly payment for another extended GM to take it's place (have a family of 6 with two not in school yet so we need the room, and no we won't drive a minivan lol)

While not unusual, it seems odd that the lifter collapsed on start up without prior warning (according to what you wrote). All that rattle could be because of the little screen under the oil pressure sensor.

The dealership will only either replace the engine with another L94 or repair the existing engine. They will not delete the AFM system.

Your least expensive option is to have them repair the system, new lifters, lifter guides, VLOM and camshaft if needed. A repair without the camshaft runs under $4K or you can do it yourself for less than half. Replacing the camshaft is obviously more involved and there is a chance that a cam bearing or two may need replacing. If that is so, the engine has to come out and the technicians don't have any way to tell beforehand. It is SOP to replace the lifter guides and VLOM when making this kind of repair.

If you or a private shop choose to delete AFM during this repair, you are basically turning the L94 into the vaunted L9H, same engine as yours without AFM. New lifters, Guides, Camshaft, and such and the computer will have to be programmed.

A new GM L94 crate motor is about $6700 plus labor, which coincides with your price quote. Keep in mind that the average life of your transmission is 160K miles.

If this were mine, I'd turn it into an L9H. (AFM delete + BlackBear tune)

 

[iamdub]

Thanks for the info, not sure how to tell if the bottom end is in good working order, I assumed something on the bottom end may have contributed to the failure but found this trying to confirm what AFM was https://www.onallcylinders.com/2017...ble-active-fuel-management-afm-on-gm-engines/

Didn't realize the AFM lifters were more prone to failure.

What's your take on the recommendation to switch to a standard volume oil pump?

Once the heads are off, you can look at the cylinder walls. Chances are that the pistons and cylinders are fine. The last one I had apart was a 181K-mile 5.3 and it still had very strong crosshatching on the walls. The only other question is if metal particles went through the oil system and got embedded in the crank, rod and cam bearings. Since the cam gets oil first, and your cam has to come out anyway, that's why I said to let condition of the cam bearings de the deciding factor on fix vs. replace.

Yes, the AFM lifters can fail, even if the system isn't activated. Of course, they'll last a lot longer if they're not operating, such as with an AFM disabler (Range device) or PCM tune. But deleting the system by replacing all the AFM parts with their non-AFM couterparts is the best way. Mine has been disabled for a couple of years now through a custom tune, and I"ll be deleting it in the next few months since I have a lifter ticking at startup that's slowly getting worse. I'm replacing the cam and lifters and all with stock GM parts. Also replacing the oil pump, timing set and all gaskets and seals while it's torn apart. Since yours has to be torn down at least that far to thoroughly diagnose, you may as well put it back together with the non-AFM stuff (if the teardown reveals it's rebuildable) and you'll never have to worry about it again. You won't miss the 1-2 highway MPG loss.

The AFM engines run a high-volume pump from the factory. There's no logical reason to switch to a standard volume for any reason.

 

[iamdub]

Dealer said when they removed the valve cover it was visible.

Did you mean valley cover? You can't see the cam with valve covers removed off the heads. You can see the tops of the lifters, but that wouldn't reveal anything. You could tell if you had collapsed lifters by the valvetrain slack in the head, though.

 

[iamdub]

If I do still opt for the new engine, wonder if its worth the plug-in AFM disabler (also mentioned in the link I sent)?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

I'd recommend this at a minimum.

 

[iamdub]

While not unusual, it seems odd that the lifter collapsed on start up without prior warning (according to what you wrote). All that rattle could be because of the little screen under the oil pressure sensor.

The dealership will only either replace the engine with another L94 or repair the existing engine. They will not delete the AFM system.

Your least expensive option is to have them repair the system, new lifters, lifter guides, VLOM and camshaft if needed. A repair without the camshaft runs under $4K or you can do it yourself for less than half. Replacing the camshaft is obviously more involved and there is a chance that a cam bearing or two may need replacing. If that is so, the engine has to come out and the technicians don't have any way to tell beforehand. It is SOP to replace the lifter guides and VLOM when making this kind of repair.

If you or a private shop choose to delete AFM during this repair, you are basically turning the L94 into the vaunted L9H, same engine as yours without AFM. New lifters, Guides, Camshaft, and such and the computer will have to be programmed.

A new GM L94 crate motor is about $6700 plus labor, which coincides with your price quote. Keep in mind that the average life of your transmission is 160K miles.

If this were mine, I'd turn it into an L9H. (AFM delete + BlackBear tune)

I was thinking the same, like maybe a solenoid stuck after the last shutdown. As you know, regardless of what caused it, a hammered cam lobe and/or collapsed lifter means mechanical damage.

If this were mine, I'd turn it into an L9H. (AFM delete + BlackBear tune

Word!

 

[NEECAPR]

Heed what wjburken said: With just the valve cover(s) removed, all you can see--or feel--is a loose push rod and rocker that is a collapsed/stuck lifter(s). BTW, just to cover all comedies, I once found a major racket like this to be a pushrod that had speared a rocker arm---became a one piece 'assembly'. Easily fixed if you have it and get right on it.

Before you spring for the big buck solutions, I'd suggest cut open the filter and see if you find it fairly clean. Only if so, I'd suggest--new filter, of course--that you add to the oil--preferably good quality new stuff--at least a pint of Marvel Mystery Oil(Mostly penetrating oil!). Just let it idle. If things then begin to quiet down-meaning lifters are coming back to life, let it idle and 'thaw' more for a while then get that oil out of there too. If you've gotten this far with success, get back to the kind of good filters and oils these guys talk about. Go only few hundred miles on the next oil with a bit more of the Mystery Oil. Then back to normal when it quiets down indicating your prayers were answered.

Have you had a new car dealer doing your oil changes? That might be the kind of crappy, troublesome, high ash "drain oil" my last dealer was using. Lots of trouble. If you do all of this stuff above and all seems okay except it won't idle smoothly, it might be ash from the PCV which, on my '99 was aimed at and clogged the injector nozzle skirts on cyls 5&7. I had to remove and clean the injector's skirts--about 5mm ID--then all has been well over the last 180K miles.

BTW, never bothered to tell anyone here--something that most of you probably already know. I haven't replaced a ball joint on our full size GMs in forty years--and here in MA--they're inspected for wear annually. Simply grease the joint when the tire is off the floor with support UNDER the lower A arm. In this condition the joint is reverse loaded so the bearing faces are completely UNLOADED and separated slightly so the grease can flow right in along with filling the bladder.

 

[blackjack]

Couple of questions....
Hop often oil changes? ...mobil1 or pennzoil syn? 5-30???
Do lifters quiet down??
What codes showing??
Anyway, even if the job is needed as described by dealer, the GOOD NEWS IS - There are MANY legit mechanics around now (due to rampant DOD Problems) that know this job inside out. I have done several and now this can be done in an afternoon! Only delay is I like to have heads done and new springs seals to match the new cam; so can stop after about 1 1/2 to 2 hours of work and send heads out. Make sure you change water pump and have new chain available if needed.
And NO, I'm not looking for any work, I'm a boat racer and commercial building renovator. BUT friends kids (mechanics) have watched me, helped a bit and done a bunch of these jobs and are HAPPY to put $1,000. in their pocket for labor. In fact one is doing an Escalade used for Lyft and Uber today, for $600.-(he needed some $$, xmas bills ya'know) $1000. for parts, fluids is about right.
DO THE WORK, don't total rebuild, don't buy new engine.
Call me if you want, I'm not selling anything - just offering hands on "ole school" experience. I've posted about this before.
Marshall 3052337777