2023 Tahoe Buying Advice - Ordering vs Looking For?

[TheGrayingTech]

I gave up looking for a new vehicle sitting on a lot.

I contacted 30 some dealers through the GM sites and almost all were pre-sold; I even started looking 1000 miles away.
The ones that were not pre-sold, they were VERY reluctant to do anything on price.

Instead, I told 4 local dealers what I wanted to jumped into the queue.

Market is hopefully changing though but I’m still expecting 3-6 months.

 

[Polo08816]

I gave up looking for a new vehicle sitting on a lot.

I contacted 30 some dealers through the GM sites and almost all were pre-sold; I even started looking 1000 miles away.
The ones that were not pre-sold, they were VERY reluctant to do anything on price.

Instead, I told 4 local dealers what I wanted to jumped into the queue.

Market is hopefully changing though but I’m still expecting 3-6 months.

So the interesting thing is there are a lot of people who have orders at multiple dealerships and will take the first arrival. I think because of this the demand is artificially higher than true demand at the moment.

 

[Stbentoak]

So the interesting thing is there are a lot of people who have orders at multiple dealerships and will take the first arrival. I think because of this the demand is artificially higher than true demand at the moment.

They have multiple orders because dealers don't care if you take it or not. They have many others waiting who will and could possibly get more for it since it's on the ground.
This would be fixed if dealers only took non refundable deposits. Would cut down all the chaff in the system...

 

[Polo08816]

They have multiple orders because dealers don't care if you take it or not. They have many others waiting who will and could possibly get more for it since it's on the ground.
This would be fixed if dealers only took non refundable deposits. Would cut down all the chaff in the system...

There's little chance people would pay a non-refundable deposit if you can't guarantee a reasonable delivery timeframe or that the vehicle will come with all the options selected.

And the refundable and non-refundable deposits would vary from dealer to dealer. Implementing a more transparent ordering process like Ford's would reduce some of the "chaff" in the system at a nationwide level.

As far as the demand/supply situation, I think you're right at the moment. I see it being substantially different in the 6-12 month timeframe as more and more dealers transition back to a volume mindset.

Manufacturers need time to adjust to the demand of 1/2 ton based full size SUVs but that should be feasible in a 2-3 year time frame. They did so with the 1/2 ton pickups from the introduction of the revised F150 in 2021 and GM 1500s in 2022. Right now supply and demand are "matched" for 1/2 ton pickups and there's certainly inventory on dealership lots.

 

[DuraYuk]

There's little chance people would pay a non-refundable deposit if you can't guarantee a reasonable delivery timeframe or that the vehicle will come with all the options selected.

And the refundable and non-refundable deposits would vary from dealer to dealer. Implementing a more transparent ordering process like Ford's would reduce some of the "chaff" in the system at a nationwide level.

As far as the demand/supply situation, I think you're right at the moment. I see it being substantially different in the 6-12 month timeframe as more and more dealers transition back to a volume mindset.

Manufacturers need time to adjust to the demand of 1/2 ton based full size SUVs but that should be feasible in a 2-3 year time frame. They did so with the 1/2 ton pickups from the introduction of the revised F150 in 2021 and GM 1500s in 2022. Right now supply and demand are "matched" for 1/2 ton pickups and there's certainly inventory on dealership lots.

The volume model is dead. Every manufacturer has stated they will not pursue that. It's more profitable to have a few vehicles on hand and order the rest as needed. It's SOP now.

 

[Polo08816]

The volume model is dead. Every manufacturer has stated they will not pursue that. It's more profitable to have a few vehicles on hand and order the rest as needed. It's SOP now.

Of course manufacturers would state (and want) that, but that doesn't mean it's the ground truth. Ultimately, you have to react to what your competitors are doing because you can't make decisions in a vacuum. Ceding market share to competitors for short term profits is a business decision.

Granger Ford has ~43 F150s in inventory: https://www.grangerford.com/searchnew.aspx?Model=F-150

Sheehy Ford (local) has about ~56 F150s in inventory: https://www.sheehyfordgaithersburg.com/new-vehicles/?_dFR[Location][0]=Sheehy%20Ford%20Lincoln%20of%20Gaithersburg&_dFR[make][0]=Ford&_dFR[model][0]=F-150&_dFR[type][0]=New&_paymentType=our_price

Robideaux GMC has about 38 Sierra 1500s in inventory: https://www.robideaux.com/VehicleSearchResults?search=new&make=GMC&model=Sierra 1500

These are some of the most competitive dealers in terms of pricing so what would inventory look like at another dealership that is looking to get MSRP?

 

[DuraYuk]

Of course manufacturers would state (and want) that, but that doesn't mean it's the ground truth. Ultimately, you have to react to what your competitors are doing because you can't make decisions in a vacuum. Ceding market share to competitors for short term profits is a business decision.

Granger Ford has ~43 F150s in inventory: https://www.grangerford.com/searchnew.aspx?Model=F-150

Sheehy Ford (local) has about ~56 F150s in inventory: https://www.sheehyfordgaithersburg.com/new-vehicles/?_dFR[Location][0]=Sheehy%20Ford%20Lincoln%20of%20Gaithersburg&_dFR[make][0]=Ford&_dFR[model][0]=F-150&_dFR[type][0]=New&_paymentType=our_price

Robideaux GMC has about 38 Sierra 1500s in inventory: https://www.robideaux.com/VehicleSearchResults?search=new&make=GMC&model=Sierra 1500

These are some of the most competitive dealers in terms of pricing so what would inventory look like at another dealership that is looking to get MSRP?

This change won't happen overnight but it is what every manufacturer is doing in America at least. A lot of those "inventory' vehicles are not on the lot yet or coming soon.

They are going to a much more lean model. Less waste and can maintain price better without tons of aging units they have to sell before they get older.

Makes sense. Having 100s of the same model never did make much sense. Takes up real estate. Gotta keep them clean. Gotta keep them secure . just tons of waste throughout.

I welcome the change.

 

[Wwes]

They are going to a much more lean model. Less waste and can maintain price better without tons of aging units they have to sell before they get older.

This can't possibly happen with the legacy mfg-dealer model. Manufacturers book the revenue when the vehicle is shipped to the dealer. Consumers buy from dealers. The manufacturers customers are the dealers, not the consumers.

The manufacturers that do direct-to-consumer models like Tesla control their process and have a much cleaner situation. Never heard of a Tesla "dealer" with a 4-square, first they don't have dealers, just delivery centers, and second they have transparent pricing because there's no middleman trying to work an additional profit.

Manufacturers have an incentive to maximize their own profit, which generally means running factories flat out.

 

[DuraYuk]

This can't possibly happen with the legacy mfg-dealer model. Manufacturers book the revenue when the vehicle is shipped to the dealer. Consumers buy from dealers. The manufacturers customers are the dealers, not the consumers.
The manufacturers that do direct-to-consumer models like Tesla control their process and have a much cleaner situation. Never heard of a Tesla "dealer" with a 4-square, first they don't have dealers, just delivery centers, and second they have transparent pricing because there's no middleman trying to work an additional profit.

Manufacturers have an incentive to maximize their own profit, which generally means running factories flat out.

We call this a change.

Covid facilitated this change.

Manufacturers and dealers got to test run something no one though possible.

Even ****** cars were getting marked up or pre sold.

Gross on vehicles during covid was incredibly high.

The lean model is the new model. The pre sold model is the new model. The placing your order and waiting for your vehicle is the new model.

It is new. As in has not been done. As in goes against the status quo. As in tesla and its ilk are also a driving force behind these decisions.

 

[TheGrayingTech]

Coming at it from the Tech side, Dell does both. We supply the channel with set configs that compete on price. Supply efficiency drives down costs and thus our BTO (build to order) units make more profit. Even with a chip shortage, Dell was still very well positioned for supply.

Taking that as a possible model, GM could still have dealer orders for a fast, local sale, but process BTO nationally. Further, they could let you choose the dealer to work through for PDI and optional addons.

I also was transparent with my dealers. I told them all, I’m in the queue at other dealers. But 1 dealer I also said, you are the closest to me and I’ll get my service done here if I buy from here. Trying to incentivize them and it’s true, I’d rather buy from them than any of the other 3.