2002 Tahoe wont run

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Steve Berg

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You have the PASSLOCK 3 system on a 2002 tahoe? And you have a transmitter on your ignition key? Pic of ignition key? I have (2) 2003 Tahoe LT's and neither have that crap on them. Maybe its a made for european market type situation.
Might be a export thing. The transmitter is under the rubber bit onthe key so you dont se it. Anyway, had all my parts now so i rebuild the whole ting to passkey II. New refurbished computer, new complete switch with harness, lock and keys. Should do the trick i hope.
 
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Steve Berg

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Anyone who knows what kind of signal the ECM receives from the BCM. As far as i can see there is two wires from the bcm to the ecm. I am twisting my head with this. Have replaced the whole harness with new ignition housing, lock and keys + installed a refurbished bcm programmed to VIN. Stil have the same problem, just starts and then cut. Security light and charge light alternate when ignition is on and security light permanent with ignition to off. Due to this i do not think the problem is with the ecm but please correct me if i am wrong.
 

engrgrl

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Anyone who knows what kind of signal the ECM receives from the BCM. As far as i can see there is two wires from the bcm to the ecm. I am twisting my head with this. Have replaced the whole harness with new ignition housing, lock and keys + installed a refurbished bcm programmed to VIN. Stil have the same problem, just starts and then cut. Security light and charge light alternate when ignition is on and security light permanent with ignition to off. Due to this i do not think the problem is with the ecm but please correct me if i am wrong.
a few questions:
A. did you end up with a passkey II (where there is a visible resistor on the key)? Did you try the passkey II relearn procedure? [1. Insert ignition key and turn to the “ON ” position. Do not attempt to start the engine. Leave the key in the “ON ” position for approximately 11 minutes. The security light will be steady on or flashing for the 11-minute period. Do not proceed to Step 2 until the security light turns off or stops flashing. 2. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position for 30 seconds. 3. Turn the ignition switch to the “ON ” position as in Step 1 for 11 minutes. 4. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position for 30 seconds. 5. Turn the ignition switch to the “ON ” position as in Step 1 for 11 minutes for a third time. 6. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position for 30 seconds for a third time. 7. Turn the ignition switch to the “ON ” position for 30 seconds. 8. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position. 9. Attempt to start the engine]

B. did you end up with a passkey III (where there would be a transponder inside the key plastic part)? Did you try the passkey III relearn procedure ? Other folks will need to comment here, but if the truck originally had the Passkey 3+ system, then I think the PCM needs to learn the new "fuel continue password" when the BCM is replaced by doing the relearn test. [When performing this relearn all previously learned keys will be erased. Additional keys may be relearned immediately after the first key has been learned by inserting the additional key and turning the ignition switch to on within 10 seconds of removing the previously learned key. 1. Insert a master key (black head) into the ignition switch. 2. Turn key to the “ON ” position without starting the engine. The security light should turn on and stay on. 3. Wait for 10 minutes or until the security light turns off. 4. Turn key to the “OFF ” position for 5 seconds. 5. Turn key to the “ON ” position without starting the engine. Security light should turn on and stay on. 6. Wait for 10 minutes or until the security light turns off. 7. Turn key to the “OFF ” position for 5 seconds. 8. Turn key to the “ON ” position without starting the engine The security light should turn on and stay on. 9. Wait for 10 minutes or until the security light turns off. 10. Turn key to the “OFF ” position. The key transponder information will be learned on the next start cycle. 11. Start the vehicle. If the vehicle starts and runs normally, the relearn is complete. 12. If additional keys need to be relearned, turn the key to the “OFF ” position. 13. Insert the next key to be learned. Turn the key to the “ON ” position within 10 seconds of removing the previously used key. 14. Wait for security light to turn off. It should happen fairly quickly. You may not notice the lamp as the transponder value will be learned immediately. 15. Repeat steps 12 through 14 for any additional keys. NOTE: If the theft deterrent relearn procedure does not work, please try the procedure again]

C. Have you replaced the ground and/or positive battery cables recently? Other GM cars and trucks sometimes have corrosion inside the battery cables (not visible from outside) that causes voltage issues that can be a fail to start and presumably a BCM not responding properly. Other folks would need to comment on this idea, but I'm thinking that's what's preventing my Tahoe from starting part of the time (I have two types of intermittent fail to start: sometimes no interior lights/no dash lights/etc OR sometimes have interior lights/dashlights but decides to not crank at all -- I'm suspicious of the battery cables on the no interior lights/no dash lights occurrences.)


To answer your question, I believe the BCM sends a serial data signal to the PCM ( the "fuel continue password" ) that is a coded signal -- supposedly the relearn procedure above would let the PCM learn to accept the "new" "fuel continue password".


From what I have seen the Tahoes sold in USA that are model year 2002 have an ignition switch that is integrated to a wiring harness and sells for about $65 USD. The Tahoes sold in the USA that are model year 2003 have an ignition switch that unplugs out of the wiring harness and replaces separately (with no harness available) sells for about $15 USD.
 

engrgrl

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Secondary question for the experts out there: If there's an issue with the vehicle ground (like the corroded ground cable) could that cause the BCM to fail to pass the correct serial data message to the PCM?

asking because of this:
Ignition Switch
The ignition switch contains the wiring and electrical switching portion of the column mounted ignition assembly. The ignition switch includes wiring pigtails which connect it to the base of the column connector. The Passlock™ sensor is an internal resistor within the ignition switch.

The ignition switch receives a 5-volt reference from the body control module (BCM) via the ignition key resistor signal circuit. When in the start position, the 5-volt reference travels through the Passlock™ sensor within the ignition switch. This creates a unique voltage value which is returned to the BCM via the off/run/crank voltage circuit.

Body Control Module (BCM)
The body control module (BCM) contains the logic of the theft deterrent system. The BCM provides the 5-volt reference to operate the Passlock™ sensor. The BCM also measures the voltage of the off/run/crank voltage. The voltage measured will indicate whether the Passlock™ sensor has been activated and whether the resistance value from the sensor is a valid value or the tamper value. If voltage measured is in the valid range, the BCM compares this voltage to a previously learned voltage code. If the voltage codes match, the BCM sends a serial data message containing a password to the engine control module (ECM). If the voltage codes do not match, or the voltage is in the tamper range, or there is a circuit fault, the BCM will not send the correct password to the ECM, and the vehicle will not start.

Engine Control Module
The engine control module (ECM) contains the remainder of the logic of the theft deterrent system. If a serial data message containing a valid password is received from the body control module (BCM), the ECM will continue to allow the fuel injectors to operate. The ECM will allow the fuel injectors to operate until it decides there is no valid password coming from the BCM. If the ECM does not receive a serial data message, or receives a serial data message with an incorrect password, the engine will crank and will not run or will start and stall immediately.
 
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Steve Berg

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a few questions:
A. did you end up with a passkey II (where there is a visible resistor on the key)? Did you try the passkey II relearn procedure? [1. Insert ignition key and turn to the “ON ” position. Do not attempt to start the engine. Leave the key in the “ON ” position for approximately 11 minutes. The security light will be steady on or flashing for the 11-minute period. Do not proceed to Step 2 until the security light turns off or stops flashing. 2. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position for 30 seconds. 3. Turn the ignition switch to the “ON ” position as in Step 1 for 11 minutes. 4. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position for 30 seconds. 5. Turn the ignition switch to the “ON ” position as in Step 1 for 11 minutes for a third time. 6. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position for 30 seconds for a third time. 7. Turn the ignition switch to the “ON ” position for 30 seconds. 8. Turn the ignition switch to the “OFF ” position. 9. Attempt to start the engine]

B. did you end up with a passkey III (where there would be a transponder inside the key plastic part)? Did you try the passkey III relearn procedure ? Other folks will need to comment here, but if the truck originally had the Passkey 3+ system, then I think the PCM needs to learn the new "fuel continue password" when the BCM is replaced by doing the relearn test. [When performing this relearn all previously learned keys will be erased. Additional keys may be relearned immediately after the first key has been learned by inserting the additional key and turning the ignition switch to on within 10 seconds of removing the previously learned key. 1. Insert a master key (black head) into the ignition switch. 2. Turn key to the “ON ” position without starting the engine. The security light should turn on and stay on. 3. Wait for 10 minutes or until the security light turns off. 4. Turn key to the “OFF ” position for 5 seconds. 5. Turn key to the “ON ” position without starting the engine. Security light should turn on and stay on. 6. Wait for 10 minutes or until the security light turns off. 7. Turn key to the “OFF ” position for 5 seconds. 8. Turn key to the “ON ” position without starting the engine The security light should turn on and stay on. 9. Wait for 10 minutes or until the security light turns off. 10. Turn key to the “OFF ” position. The key transponder information will be learned on the next start cycle. 11. Start the vehicle. If the vehicle starts and runs normally, the relearn is complete. 12. If additional keys need to be relearned, turn the key to the “OFF ” position. 13. Insert the next key to be learned. Turn the key to the “ON ” position within 10 seconds of removing the previously used key. 14. Wait for security light to turn off. It should happen fairly quickly. You may not notice the lamp as the transponder value will be learned immediately. 15. Repeat steps 12 through 14 for any additional keys. NOTE: If the theft deterrent relearn procedure does not work, please try the procedure again]

C. Have you replaced the ground and/or positive battery cables recently? Other GM cars and trucks sometimes have corrosion inside the battery cables (not visible from outside) that causes voltage issues that can be a fail to start and presumably a BCM not responding properly. Other folks would need to comment on this idea, but I'm thinking that's what's preventing my Tahoe from starting part of the time (I have two types of intermittent fail to start: sometimes no interior lights/no dash lights/etc OR sometimes have interior lights/dashlights but decides to not crank at all -- I'm suspicious of the battery cables on the no interior lights/no dash lights occurrences.)


To answer your question, I believe the BCM sends a serial data signal to the PCM ( the "fuel continue password" ) that is a coded signal -- supposedly the relearn procedure above would let the PCM learn to accept the "new" "fuel continue password".


From what I have seen the Tahoes sold in USA that are model year 2002 have an ignition switch that is integrated to a wiring harness and sells for about $65 USD. The Tahoes sold in the USA that are model year 2003 have an ignition switch that unplugs out of the wiring harness and replaces separately (with no harness available) sells for about $15 USD.
i ended up buying the passlock II complete set with new keys, switch and housing. The passlock and passkey do the same job i believe. Problem is that export cars is fitted with a different system so i also bought a bcm and a win coded pcm from USA and with securiy disable on the pcm. Should arrive on monday and i should know for sure if this makes the car start. Have a krank and ignition with the new key and only code is the start signal to the pcm. I tryed all different ways to relearn but my security light wont go off, tried ignition on for hours even but security light did not change.
 
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Steve Berg

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Ok. Have the car running with a security delete on the PCM. Export Tahoes have a very different security set up from those sold in USA. My only issue now is that the security light is on all the time in the multi display. Anyone who knows if it is possible to program (delete) the signal which trigger this warning and still have all the other warnings coming up in the display? Must be a wire somwhere that feed the security signal to the instrument panel.
 

rockola1971

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Ok. Have the car running with a security delete on the PCM. Export Tahoes have a very different security set up from those sold in USA. My only issue now is that the security light is on all the time in the multi display. Anyone who knows if it is possible to program (delete) the signal which trigger this warning and still have all the other warnings coming up in the display? Must be a wire somwhere that feed the security signal to the instrument panel.
Believe that comes across the serial data line. Just cut the bulb off the board or throw black tape over the symbol on the IC.
 

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